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Obama Says 'Torture' Before UN General Assembly

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Speaking today to the United Nations General Assembly, President Obama used the word "torture" for the first time when addressing an international body.

On my first day in office, I prohibited - without exception or equivocation - the use of torture by the United States of America. I ordered the prison at Guantanamo Bay closed, and we are doing the hard work of forging a framework to combat extremism within the rule of law. Every nation must know: America will live its values, and we will lead by example.

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September 23, 2009 10:28 AM   

Whoop-di-doo. I don't care if YOU prohibit torture. Your predecessor did NOT, and whoever follows you MAY not either. The LAW prohibits torture, IF YOU PROSECUTE THE OFFENDERS.

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September 23, 2009 11:04 AM    in reply to CranialRectalLoopback

Really? You're anti-torture but you don't care that the sitting POTUS signed a prohibition against it on Day One? How does that work exactly? Oh, and FYI, the POTUS isn't a prosecutor. Just thought you should take that into account... I'm anxious to read your "tortured" criticism.

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September 23, 2009 11:23 AM    in reply to ondioline

George Bush assured us that "the US does not torture."

Since you're such a big believer in presidential pronouncements, I have to assume that that completely satisfied you.

Or is it just because it's coming from Obama that we should be satisfied that it means what we want it to mean?

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September 23, 2009 3:45 PM    in reply to Mad Dog Rackham

Do you know what happens when you assume? It makes ME think U are an ASS. I'm sure you're very impressed with yourself that you woke up on the sarcastic side of the bed; I, on the otherhand, am less impressed, which is to say not at all impressed.

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September 23, 2009 2:52 PM    in reply to ondioline

Do they pay you to do this all day long or are you just a lemming willing to follow dear leader wherever he leads you? Are you so bereft of common sense you don't see how silly and beside the point your defense of Obama is on this?

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September 23, 2009 3:43 PM    in reply to oleeb

Please try to read for comprehension. I didn't offer a defense; I asked a question. (You really don't want to play the "I'm getting fresh with Ondioline on the Internet" game. I promise you.)

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September 23, 2009 5:38 PM    in reply to ondioline

All you do is come online and defend anything and everything Obama. Give me a break. You're a shill plain and simple.

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September 23, 2009 5:42 PM    in reply to oleeb

By that criterium, so are you.

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September 30, 2009 1:45 AM    in reply to Karl the Marxist

What? I don't think you are reading that correctly as I do not defend Obama willy nilly on everything. Neither do I criticize him on everything.

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September 23, 2009 10:46 AM   

okay, I've got a technical request--earlier this morning you had the big banner headline story about Conrad using another CBO request to delay the finance committee bill--now it's disappeared and you've got this one. If you're going to replace one banner story for another, can you at least place the previous one beneath or next to the new one somewhere on your main page?.
As it is now, you make it very hard to find stories you had just posted within hours, and it's not very user-friendly.
Thanks--

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September 23, 2009 10:53 AM   

Poppycock. Without enforcement, your "prohibition" is worse than meaningless, it is a wink to go ahead and do "what has to be done."

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September 23, 2009 11:05 AM    in reply to Egypt Steve

Same question to you Steve; per my message above:

Really? You're anti-torture but you don't care that the sitting POTUS signed a prohibition against it on Day One? How does that work exactly?

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September 23, 2009 11:09 AM   

Obama made his biggest mistake when he trusted anything said to him by Bush-Cheney's military and Bush-Cheney's intelligence services. They will gladly sacrifice Obama to their most important mission; avoiding any kind of accounting, moral, legal, financial or military, for the last eight years.

Oh, and Barack, baby, you don't prohibit torture, the law does. How far do you want to continue down l'etat, she's-a moi avenue? I bet you take it all the way to the blame for Bush's wars.

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September 23, 2009 11:11 AM   

Seems like we see part of a pattern in these comments. President does something important, progressives step all over the story by calling it meaningless, and ask for more, not by seizing on good news to build momentum, but by essentially calling the prez a sell-out.

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September 23, 2009 11:14 AM    in reply to fbacon2

I want it all and I want it right now.

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September 23, 2009 11:24 AM    in reply to acamus

I really can't get over this. Not to be flip or dismissive of anybody, but the decision to come before the General Assembly and not mince words about torture will be noticed around the world. This speech mattered, and believe me there were officials within the administration urging him not to use the word.

For all the energy we've put into fighting Cheney's and the MSM's corruption of the English language when it comes to torture, the fact that Obama laid down his mark in an international forum should count for something.

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September 23, 2009 2:54 PM    in reply to fbacon2

Well the fact is Bush said much the same while his henchmen were busy breaking the law at will. Such statements by Obama or any other President mean nothing when they refuse to enforce the laws against torture in cases where we know the law has been broken and it is also meaninglyess to trumpet the closing of Guantanamo when the President is simply replacing it with Bagram where the very same inhuman treatment and indefinite detentions without charges are being carried out and defended by the Obama adminsitration.

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September 23, 2009 3:18 PM    in reply to oleeb

I thank you for making my point.

I'm just gobsmacked at any equivalence drawn between the statements on torture between Bush and Obama, the latter of whom is adding the phrase "without exception or equivocation" and more or less conceding before the world something that even the WashPost and NY Times won't even admit. When we get reports and photos bearing out a torture policy ordered by the Obama WH and legitimized by Obama's DOJ lawyers, then maybe we can consider like with like.

The fact is that there will be many who won't accept any outcome less than seeing Bush and Cheney in the dock. I wish for the life of me that we could see them all arrested, but that doesn't lead me to reject out of hand any improvement to reclaim America's standing on torture. This is essentially a repeat of the slippery argument that the absence of a Truth Commission has "in effect" ratified past torture, which then somehow morphs into Obama being as guilty as Bush and Cheney.

On a final note, it's good we acknowledge that the president is closing Guantanamo, even if he is in your words replacing it with Bagram, because I thought the line for the last few months was that Guantanamo was another on a list of failed promises--ignoring of course the mindless NIMBYism and neocon claptrap gumming up the works.

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September 23, 2009 3:52 PM    in reply to fbacon2

Five bucks says oleeb isn't bright enough to realize how it made your point. But thank you for expressing what you did nonetheless. I had an argument with someone (whose intelligence I actually greatly respect) who was pissed at Obama for keeping Gates on as SecDef but couldn't give a single reason beyond "he was Bush's SecDef." This individual further accused Obama of reneging on his campaign promises as it related to troop levels, but couldn't get beyond "the troops aren't already out of Iraq; the numbers should be down around 50K already; he promised 16 months not 19 months..."

I'm startled to see how reasonably intelligent individuals (not that I've seen any evidence of oleeb's intelligence, but work with me) are incapable of thinking back less than a year (or less than two in the case of the primaries) and grasping the notion that the choice was not between Obama and Kucinich or Obama and Bill Maher or Obama and the most liberal ideal or person they know... There's this thing called governance. It's a lot trickier than ranting mindlessly on a website. I'm tempted to say "they should try it," but the mind thinks of the Joe Wilsons of the world and retorts "be careful what you wish for..."

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September 23, 2009 5:37 PM    in reply to fbacon2

It's naive people like yourself that allow the erosion of our consitution, our laws and our liberty.

You go ahead and take the word of a politician who says "trust me." As for me, I'll stand by those who want to see the existing laws enforced in a Republican and not rely on the goodwill of a monarch regardless of party.

Obama's personal assurances of no further law breaking are belied by his practices in Afghanistan where he continues the same practices as were carried out at Guantanamo and here at home where he supports covering up the criminal activities of the past, refuses to denounce all torture as commonly accepted worldwide and does not say what is and is not torture under his regime. You and those who agree with you are gullible fools who choose the word of a man over enforcement of the law.

If we are a nation of laws and not of men why do we fear enforcing them? Why are you willing to have them go unenforced? What if it was your brother or sister or mother or father being tortured? What if one of your family members was murdered? What if they were held incommunicado for years on end and driven to insanity? Would you not want the laws against such barbarous acts enforced?

This has nothing to do with Bush/Cheney personally though they were the people at the top of the criminal activities. Nor is it about Obama personally. Look at the evidence of criminal wrongdoing on the part of our government both now and then. This has to do with the rule of law. You, obviously, consider the rule of law optional. You're entitled to your navie and gullible opinion. Sorry, but I don't.

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September 23, 2009 5:40 PM    in reply to oleeb

Sorry, should have written "in a republic" and not Republican. Typo!

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September 23, 2009 8:06 PM    in reply to oleeb

At the risk of being gullible enough to respond to name-calling, I'll just finish by saying that I never found it useful to label US administrations, even ones guilty of crimes, as regimes. We can catch up as the special prosecutor investigation progresses.

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September 23, 2009 3:43 PM    in reply to acamus

I want it all and I want it right now.

If not us, then who? If not now, then when?

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September 23, 2009 6:18 PM   

I'm encouraged that Obama talked about torture to the UN general assembly. Bear in mind that most heads of state, allies, stated enemies, neutral parties are there. Bear in mind that all have now a healthy skepticism of what our country says, hence Obama's mention of "leading by example." Bear also in mind that every word that a head of state says is parsed to death by other countries (and us too). Him stating this outright isn't exactly an apology, but it is an admission and a wish that we will do better.

On this issue, I don't know how we can erase the past misdeeds. Actually, we can't erase anything. The only recourse is to vehemently declare that this is not our policy from this day forward. I think that there needs to be some new law spelling out in forceful terms what future infractions that violators of a treaty that we have signed (like, say, the Geneva Convention perhaps?) will warrant in the future.

So, yes, this is encouraging. I do think, however, that a vehement declaration could also be matched by some backbone at home and some decisive action to those who've destroyed what we stand for. We can ensure that it won't happen again in the future, but how do we atone for what the assholes who perpetrated torture in our country did in the past?

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September 23, 2009 8:43 PM   

I'll be encouraged when I see Obama close Bagram. So far, he's just moved the practice to a less exposed location. On this stuff, words don't count.

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