It's standard headline writing practice. Normally it would be reserved for "second reference" but here, I think everyone knows which Obama he is referring to.

yes, kudos to the louisiana rep. who voted his district; but then we must honestly admit - check out both nytimes and washingtonpost for graphics - so too did those democrats who voted against it, mostly freshmen, mostly in districts that went for mccain, more senior populations.

i guess the question really is, "why did these individuals run as democrats in the first place?"

as much as i want to be excited by the house passage of health care reform, this is exactly what happened in '94 - passed the house, came to vote in the senate in an election year and failed.

15 years later, we are still trying to get the senate to pass health care reform. no wonder, the gop and their health insurance cronies think they can run the same playbook again successfully.

Obama betrayed women and Pelosi also.

And I don't like that there is still a giveaway to the private insurers without a single payer option open to everyone to drive down costs. That failure cuts across gender, race and sexual orentation lines.

However, here are my two perspectives in trying to contain disappointment and, at the same time, try to preserve proportionality:

1. What would — what did — we get under Republican control? Just look at their proposed bill... . They only came up with that lame piece of sh*t to fog peoples' brains into thinking they were offering "positive" alternatives. Yeah. Right. Under their control, the result for HCR is nada.

2. It is far, far easier to tweak, push, prod and correct legislation that is already on the books than it is to put it on the books to begin with. That's why we've been fighting for a century to have universal health care and still don't have it. And why don't we have it? Conservative/Big Business opposition. Every time.

The final question for me is this: Am I so dissatisfied with making not as much forward movement as I would like (and it is forward movement) that it will be worth handing governmental control back to the very people who have opposed ANY forward movement at all in 2010 or 2012?

If, in our zeal to "purify" the Democratic party, we do exaclty what the Rethugs are doing right now in their quest for purity — and our method for doing this is punishment of the whole party by throwing the bums out, not contributing to their campaigns or just staying home from the polls — then I assert that we will just be handing control back to the very people that will pull this thing all apart once more. And maybe worse.

Take a look at the Tea-baggers and tell me if those are the people you want running government, providing health care or diving into our persnal lives. Failing to prevent them from taking over once more is more than Good Principle. It is petulant self-destruction.

By saying that, while it may have this affect, it is not my position to disagree or minimize the fact that the Stupak amendment not only disses one real concern for many women but it likely unconstitutional. It's bad. Period. It will need to be challenged and corrected. When we can get it through.

This is a slo-o-ow country where reforms are concerned. That also is a sad, sad fact. Slavery was "ended" by the Civil War, but it was not until the Jim Crow apartheid was ended one hundred years later before African Americans actually got their first tastes of equality and real freedom.

This is no end to the fight for freedom of health, and equality in delivering it. It is only just the beginning. And passing the House bill was the easiest part.

I agree with you "happily independent." I contacted Dem. congressman Heath Shuler of N. Carolina tonight. He too was one of the 39 'nays.' I told him I was disappointed in him, that I knew he wasn't a Democrat because he liked the Donkey symbol but because he had some considerable identification with ordinary people. The way I see it, Congressman Shuler and the other 38 Democrats who voted against health reform tonight are lost; they need to rediscover why they're Democrats and find the voice to lead their constituents into this bright future. This is, without a doubt, the biggest event since the passage of Social Security in 1935. I'm one proud American tonight.

And thank all that is holy that we aren't still under the control of the neo-skinheads. After all, their agenda is the straight-out repeal of Roe itself. And, after the last eight years of stacking the SC, they're almost there. Just this close to their fever dream goal. And that is to say nothing about their Voodoo Economics giveaways to the rich and powerful plans that have wrecked the world economy.

With that in mind, what do you suppose are your options in 2010 or 2012?

and all of those "developed countries" that have universal health care as their system have under treated citizens and deteriorating health systems. Those able to afford to come to the USA for treatment do, because the survival rates are so much higher. Read a book or something.

So Rob... after failing to muddy the waters in your earlier post by making claims that are simply wrong and then claiming to have read a book you now feel the need to elevate the discussion to the level that is fitting for advancement in the Republican leadership.

My what an articulate and thoughtful statement. If that statement is the best you can do the best you can do should remain undone.